[00:00:00.650] - DORI DURBIN
Hello and welcome to The Power of Kids Books Podcast, where we believe books are a catalyst to inspire and empower change. Today's podcast is an expert and author edition. And you know how I love to find out on these podcasts what we should know and teach our kids about their lives and their futures. Today we are speaking to a lady who is an egg freezing  support coach and has her own kids book series, The ABCs of How You Had Me. And it focuses on encouraging confidence in every child's story. So welcome. Vanessa Hunt.

[00:00:37.350] - Vanessa Hunt
Thank you so much for having me. Thank you.

[00:00:39.890] - DORI DURBIN
Oh, absolutely. I was talking to you a little before the podcast started, and I am impressed that you have a whole series. That's quite an accomplishment.
 
[00:00:51.410] - Vanessa Hunt
Yeah, thank you. Every story has an audience, and there are so many different types of families that are looking at donor conception. So it was very easy to come up with a series to represent as many of the different family models as possible.

[00:01:11.670] - DORI DURBIN
That's amazing. I'm sure a lot of people really don't have a lot of information for their kids about that kind of concept either.

 [00:01:19.610] - Vanessa Hunt
I think there's more and more. One of the classics that I think of is the Pea that was me. So there are some, but in the Facebook groups online, I see from time to time, there's people out there looking for resources to read to their donor conceived children.

[00:01:41.460] - DORI DURBIN
Yeah. Well, can you give us a little bit of background as far as what exactly an egg freezing support coach does?

 [00:01:49.410] - Vanessa Hunt
Yeah. Well, so the egg freezing support is for people with ovaries who are interested in preserving or looking at their fertility preservation. And so it's very often an emotive process, an emotional process, where it's often a layered decision, and you're taking in factors about your current life in order to future pace where you want to be. So you're looking at your finances, you're looking at your relationships with yourself and others, you're looking at the overall stability in your life and where you think you might be. And so for some people, it's quite and we're not even getting into the health part of it, so it can be kind of an overwhelming process for some people. A lot of stress can be very stressful. And you're creating opportunity. The hope is, anyway, we're creating opportunity by investing in yourself to be able to have genetically related children later on in life. And so I felt that it was important to particularly after looking at my own journey, to be able to serve women, people with ovaries in this way.

 [00:03:15.840] - DORI DURBIN
Yeah. And are you comfortable sharing your own journey?

 [00:03:20.290] - Vanessa Hunt
Absolutely. I really have to because it was really the spark and the catalyst. So my own story begins, yes, of course, with egg freezing, because that's technically the first part of the IVF process. But I began the journey largely as a single mom by choice. And so I would jump right into IVF. And also, for me, being a micro business owner, it was important, considering my age, that I would have to go and factor in as many potential tries as possible. And so my search took me to Europe, where the overall cost in general of IVF is less than in the US. And so I started looking at different countries, and I became acutely aware of donor anonymity laws within those countries. For example, the first country that I looked at was Spain. And in Spain, they only permit anonymous donors. And so, thinking about that, I decided to go on and look at other countries. And at one time, believe it or not, dory, I had signed on with a clinic in Keeve.

 [00:04:41.850] - DORI DURBIN
Wow.

 [00:04:45.370] - Vanessa Hunt
So anyway, I ended up at a clinic in Sofia, Bulgaria. I was doing multiple back to back egg retrievals, and it gave me a lot of time. And during that time, yes, I was writing books and working on bringing up the coaching business. And yeah, I think that.

 [00:05:11.090] - DORI DURBIN
It was.

[00:05:11.650] - Vanessa Hunt
Important to look at the different aspects that went into it. So the egg freezing came out of it. The egg freezing support coaching, but then also the children's books, which are intended for people that have already become parents.

 [00:05:30.010] - DORI DURBIN
So really, you're taking your own experience, your own research, and condensing it down kidsizing it into information that parents can use and talk to their kids about it.

 [00:05:41.260] - Vanessa Hunt
Yes, absolutely. It was intended to be bedtime stories to comfortably introduce that birth narrative in a relaxed environment. So that was really the goal of the kids books.

[00:05:58.250] - DORI DURBIN

That's a really cool idea. And I love that you had such a journey. I feel bad that you had such a journey, but I also love it because you understand the complexity of trying to even have the process done, much less your commitment to it. So tell me a little bit about your series, in particular your book Why My Name is Sophia.

[00:06:20.470] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah. So the series, The ABCs of How You Had Me, is a series of books written for the different types of families that could and use assisted reproduction and the help of a donor, a gamete donor. And so I have a two mom story out, I have a single mom story out, and the single dad story is coming out very soon. All are available on Amazon. But Why My Name Is Sophia is my most personal story, where I gave the illustrator a picture of the doctor, and I gave the illustrator a picture of me, and I said, don't make the character look like me.

[00:07:10.010] - DORI DURBIN

Because I.

[00:07:10.520] - Vanessa Hunt

Just didn't want too much. I took Muse and the other stories. But yeah, so Why My Name Is Sophia is more the personal story being over there taking pictures of the monuments and unique representations of the city of Sophia.

[00:07:32.930] - DORI DURBIN

Okay, I didn't even put that together that it was a city. We were talking just a little bit before as well about the process of writing a kid's book and so you've got this personal story that you're trying to, like I said, kid size into something that's shareable for others that's personal, but not so personal that you can't see it out there. How is the process for you and what surprised you about the journey of writing a kid's book?

[00:08:03.930] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah, I think with the series, the goal by and large was the same in every book so I probably had it easy compared to some other people. So the goal is we're explaining babies, how they come, and then we're going to throw in some hospital shots and we're going to make it where we're going to give enough detail, but not too much detail, because I want the parents to fill in their own story. And then I wanted to just put in enough to where curiosity would be peaked. The goal by and large was the same for every book but I have to say the first one was quite a cathartic process because at that time I was still sort of sorting out the question for myself would I use an anonymous donor versus a known donor? And for me, the answer became quite clear, which I would use and recognizing that the choice is different and unique for everyone. And I think for me, it was very clear to do. And so, again, not to write that into the story, how I felt about it specifically, because, again, I recognize people would make different choices about the decision.

[00:09:39.060] - Vanessa Hunt

And so I chose to leave that part out because at the end of the day, this is the story for the child.

[00:09:47.210] - DORI DURBIN

Yeah. And that's the complexity of trying to have your own story and yet leave it open enough for interpretation and to connect with more people. It's a little bit of a tricky line there.

[00:09:57.330] - Vanessa Hunt

It was, yeah. And trying to be sensitive to kind of a hot it's a hot topic. There are many Facebook groups around it known versus anonymous and I felt that wasn't the goal of the books.

[00:10:14.410] - DORI DURBIN

And your goal really is to give the kids confidence about where they came from.

[00:10:19.260] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah, the goal of the books was to sort of introduce the dialogue about being donor conceived in the most gentle way possible. And my solution was the bedtime story where people are winding down and to write the story in a sort of a general way that piqued curiosity and that conversation and hopefully a dialogue could begin.

[00:10:47.650] - DORI DURBIN

Yeah, that's great. Have you heard any gotten any input back from your readers?

[00:10:52.840] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah, I have. I've gotten some really wonderful feedback from women who are just so happy that there's even a resource out there. I mean, I mentioned a book earlier but it was interesting because it was a beautiful book. But many of the books that I saw did not include human characters, and that was quite odd to me that a story that is so marvelously human did not include human characters, and so it was very interesting. So I was sure to include human characters because that idea of being able to see yourself child, being able to see oneself as the main character yeah. Main character energy.

[00:11:43.590] - DORI DURBIN

Yeah, that would be really difficult. I mean, it's doable, but I think seeing actual people would make a huge difference and an easier leap for kids. So would you be willing to read some of your book?

[00:11:56.070] - Vanessa Hunt

Oh, my god. I would be so honored. Yes, I would love that. Thank you for asking me.

[00:12:04.230] - DORI DURBIN

Why don't you read us a little bit of it? My name is sophia.

[00:12:07.460] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah. Okay. Before I was born, mommy took a trip to a place called sophia to find a doctor. The doctor helps a lot of women become mommies. He helped mommy to have a baby me. And since mommy lived alone and did not have a partner, mommy needed the help of a gamete donor. A gamete donor is someone who has given extra cells to help women like mommy. The gamete donor can be male or female. A gamete donor can help all kinds of people who wish to have a family.

[00:12:43.350] - DORI DURBIN

Awesome. I love that you've incorporated everything together. I mean, it's not like you're using real words. You're including that it could be male or female. Donor wise, you're explaining that there's somebody who came along to help. I think that's awesome. Is your whole book very what's the word I want it's not clinical, but it's using the proper terminology, then, yes.

[00:13:08.030] - Vanessa Hunt

I say sperm. I say embryo, I say gamete donor. And these are medical terms, and everything relative to what is necessary, I think, for a child to understand in the process.

[00:13:27.350] - DORI DURBIN

Well, I just love the fact that you're not hiding the medical terminology, because I think when kids are equipped with terminology, you're able to talk about it honestly with real terms, and that's refreshing. So great work on that.

[00:13:41.140] - Vanessa Hunt

Thank you. Thank you so much.

[00:13:43.240] - DORI DURBIN

So, with your job, I'm assuming that you're able to use your book and hand it out as your coaching, maybe?

[00:13:51.070] - Vanessa Hunt

No, not necessarily. You would think that, but no, because the women that are looking at egg freezing may not have even really decided whether they want to have children. I know that sounds crazy, but sometimes in thinking about it, they're still sort of weighing out the question in their minds. And so, yeah, it's kind of a different part of the journey. So I actually keep two separate instagram accounts, and they're really two different worlds. Really?

[00:14:31.590] - DORI DURBIN

I never thought about that, how that would be such a split. And that's a totally different mental position and place in life.

[00:14:38.410] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah. I mean, the egg freezing, they are going through egg retrievals, and they're choosing to keep their eggs frozen. It's really just a different part of the journey. I don't know if they would be donors in the future. I suppose that's up to them. But yeah. This is egg freezing support coaching is for women who want to have children that are genetically related to them later in life and just want to keep that option available to them.

[00:15:21.700] - DORI DURBIN

That's very good. Yeah. So with your job, do you ever have things that are just surprising that you didn't really expect to have?

[00:15:29.290] - Vanessa Hunt

Honestly, I love this question, and a surprising one is secondary infertility. Yeah. Dori you would really be surprised that the need for egg freezing even applies to people who have already had children? Yes. You would not think it life happens. Right. People get divorced, there are deaths. I mean, a myriad of options. Right. And so some people are actually surprised. They think that you get pregnant once you're good, meaning it's possible later on. And that's not necessarily the case. And that is so surprising. And I think if there's any awareness I could specifically raise in this call, it would be around that the secondary infertility piece. It even makes sense to freeze eggs after you've had children.

[00:16:28.570] - DORI DURBIN

Yeah. That's something I wouldn't have ever thought about, ever.

[00:16:32.030] - Vanessa Hunt

It's a surprise. Yes. I had that question already to go. You're like, for a surprise. I was like, I've got to share that one. It's huge.

[00:16:42.560] - DORI DURBIN

Yeah, because you were right. You would think that if you had three kids or two kids or even one kid, you're more likely to go ahead and be able to conceive again. But I can see how life and circumstantial events, physical things, changes could prevent that. It's wild.

[00:17:00.370] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah.

[00:17:01.080] - DORI DURBIN

Wow. How about for parents? If you were trying to equip their kids with kind of this knowledge, this new knowledge that they're from a different kind of situation than the other kids, what would you want them to equip their kids with?

[00:17:19.230] - Vanessa Hunt

Yeah, I think this is a book that can be read by children, read for children that are not donor conceived as well as donor conceived, because it's all about being inclusive and respecting the different types of families out there. And I think being sensitive to that is really important. But I think the younger generations are already so I think they're just more predisposed. And I'm just so honored that this series could be a resource in that.

[00:18:05.770] - DORI DURBIN

I hope that you're able to get some of them into OB clinics and into areas where people could really use them. Have you had any luck with that?

[00:18:16.110] - Vanessa Hunt

I haven't yet. I have been working so hard just to bring it to market, but I'm actually doing this call from a library today, and so I hope to make a donation to the library with the book that I've read.

[00:18:32.050] - DORI DURBIN

That's fantastic. Fantastic. Yeah, definitely. Okay, so if anybody's listening out there and has a clinic or any kind of practice you need to get a hold of Vanessa and get her book so you can help spread that.

[00:18:43.030] - Vanessa Hunt

I love that.

[00:18:44.340] - DORI DURBIN

Thanks for the club. Yes, absolutely. Well, Vanessa, where can they find your book and you, if they want to follow or connect with you or have more questions?

[00:18:55.530] - Vanessa Hunt

Oh, thank you. That would be amazing. Feel free to reach out. I'm on Instagram at the ABCs of how you had me and you can also find the ABCs of how you had me on Amazon under Vanessa Emily Hunt.

[00:19:14.750] - DORI DURBIN

Awesome. Well, I want to thank you for your time today. Thank you for your willingness to share your personal story, not only to us, but also in a book that kids can enjoy. So. Thank you, Vanessa. Dori.

[00:19:26.920] - Vanessa Hunt

It's been amazing. Thank you so much.